| MightyMidget |
may have to cut and paste link....
S |
|
|
| colossus |
| Thanks. You're fast! I was working on it when you replied! lol;) |
|
|
| MightyMidget |
that seems kinda iffy......at first I thought that he was ok....then wen he said that the suspect had a broken eye socket, nose and jaw I kinda started thinking......
gotta love our f*cked up system.....best he get a lawyer and some good witnesses (ie neighbour and friend)
S |
|
|
| POX |
| maybe he just fell on his face afew times:dunno: |
|
|
| MightyMidget |
quote:
Originally posted by colossus
Thanks. You're fast! I was working on it when you replied! lol;)
I am at work and it is VERY slow......lots of reading tonight!!
S |
|
|
| GeoffDonk |
| Taurus SHO's :rolleyes: |
|
|
| BlueTurboEGG |
This goes back to the whole "self-defense within reason"
If you beat the thief within an inch of his life, then you better get ready for another battle... the legal one.
If you "respond" to each threat "posed by the agressor/thug" you haev a better chance of surviving a court battle.
ie: Each time he came at me I had to either disarm him, or attampted to control him with a wrist lock/arm bar, etc.
versus:
He came at me, I pouned him into the ground and didn't stop until he stopped moving.
What sounds better to a jury?
Lets cross-examine.
His first problem was was the lacrosse stick, not a good idea. Perhaps a better choice would've been a broom with the brush intact. The broom may appear less threatening in court than a lacrosse stick. Perhaps his usage of it hitting him in the knee would be ok because you are attampting to stop a violent attacker with reasonable force "crosschecking him in the face" may not have been the best choice here.
Perhaps a combination of an armlock/leg lock with the stick after a solid hit to the knee would've appeared better to a jury and would've prevented three important things:
1- further injury to the theif (which *could* be proven in court because of the available options to you with a lacrosse stick, but chose not to because all you are attempting to do is regain control of a potentially violent situation)
2- injury to the defendant, by utilizing the stick in a "control" situation such as an armbar of sorts, you can keep your distance and would've prevented further agression by the theif.
3- Most importantly, by maintaining control of the suspect with a lock of some sort, this would've prevented a further "beat down" on him.
A little something to think about and consider when you have some free time so you know what to do *IF* it ever happens.
Acting on adrenaline alone gets you deeper in dung.
Self defense is risky, even tougher to prove in court, but by keeping a level head you'll cover you ass both on the street and in a court of law. |
|
|
| VerbotenZ34 |
Hmmm,.....Taurus SHO (Supremely Highly Overrated)
I agree with BlueTurbo; however, if it was my car in said situation, I admit I would have a difficult time keeping a level head (ie sleeper hold as opposed to arm lock/leglock;) )
Verboten |
|
|
| TrevorK |
You think a jury would convict on that charge?
Hell no - because they're gonna think "What if it was me". |
|
|
| Insomniac |
Andy, I don't agree what you're saying.
It's all fine as a a texbook style of self defence, but the real world isn't a class room.
If I caught someone trying to break into my house or steal my car and things got physical, they wouldn't get an arm lock with a broom stick. More like a bat to the face. Beat down, ask questions later.
Can never be too safe. What if you did a wrist lock and the guy shanked you with his free arm? Would't happen if he was knocked out.
my 2c :D |
|
|
| BlueTurboEGG |
You guys are missing the point of my post.
Textbook and street different things yes.
But I'm talking about covering your ass for the ensuing legal battle.
How much do you want to bet that there is a good chance the owner of the vehicle is going to get charged with assault and/or excessive use of force?.
Great, you still have your car, but now you face a lawsuit and someone suing the crap out of you.
If it was your car and that was you in place of the other vehicle owner.
I bet you a case could be made against you because of your fighting career that you're agressive and combative. The odds are suddenly out of your ball park. Do you see where I'm going?.
What you need to do is expand your horizons and consier some different scenarios.
You should see what can be done to someone with a steel pen.
You want to learn about real world training, goto the Training Center.
It just all sounds better to a jury.
ie: "Well, I stabbed him with my knife that I carry around"
As opposed to "Well, I stabbed him with my pen that I carry around"
Prosecutor and/or Lawyer: "You carry a knife too don't you? why didn't you use that?" Here you can make a case where you don't go everyday in some sort of "premeditation" of going out and stabbing someone with your knife, but to escalate to it. Just another way to cover your ass, because you're in the thiefs arena now.
A shot with a "broomstick" to the side of the knee on someone with their back turned would be enough to take anyone down, from there I would apply a reverse wrist lock and take him down with my foot in his back.
No stabbing going to happen here, if he goes for a weapon, so what, you yank on the arm you have locked, the pain will make him drop whatever he's going for not to mention his face is pressed into pavement at the moment... If I put some one in a lock the bastard is NOT moving.
We as innocents have to think and act smarter than the thug. Saves alot of trouble down the road.
And I can't believe you just told me "You can never be too safe" :p |
|
|
| bomberman |
| I talked to Ian, and the thief is claiming that he used excessive force. SO lets hope he doesn't get in trouble for defending his car. BTW, i wouldn't go so far as to say the SHO is highly overrated Verboten, buts thats a different thread. The Z34 is a different story... |
|
|
| Inzane |
At least the guy didn't lose his car, and there's one less scumbag car thief out on the street right now. Hopefully the thief is reconsidering his choice of profession from now on.
But still, the extent of his injuries go WAAAY beyond reasonable. I wouldn't wish a broken jaw or wrecked eye socket on anyone... (short of maybe a murderer or rapist...). |
|
|
| VerbotenZ34 |
quote:
Originally posted by bomberman
BTW, i wouldn't go so far as to say the SHO is highly overrated Verboten, buts thats a different thread. The Z34 is a different story...
Touche :p
Verboten |
|
|
| quadraphonic |
Come on.. we've got a bunch of softies here. The guy was trying to steal his car, and I'm sure he would've tried everything he could've to get away.
I'm glad the guy took a few good hits. Criminals are scum and the fact that the lousy edmonton pig department is pressing charges is complete hypocrisy.
I know for a fact that officers will goad guys into fights on the street just for a little "fun".
Maybe they were just mad our hero beat them to it. |
|
|
| arabian_ryda |
| me and my cuzins broke some guys legs and a couple of ribs after he robbed our burger joint in the summer we used a broom and a 2 by 4 and we never got charged. its all comes down to what u say to the cops we told them we only used the broom and that we only hit him 7 times but like the guy in the story he told the cops he used a stick of some sort but it was dark he could of said something else and gotten away with it. |
|
|
| Flex |
Someone was talking about restraining the person with arm bars and leg locks and such. Ya thats a great idea but not everyone knows that kinda thing. Also we have no idea of the size of the criminal. Im not gonna approach some monster with out something in my hands. And I tell you I would call the cops right away but I couldnt stand by and watch my property being stolen......could you???
We have a bat under our bed and as I work out of town I told my gf if anyone ever breaks in the house lock the bedroom door and call the cops and if that door opens and any body part pokes thru the door dont stop hitting it with the bat til it quits moving. I'd rather be battleing an assault charge in court then her fighting for her life in a hospital bed.
With a good lawyer he should be ok |
|
|
| Kiddo |
| i don't know about you guys but i don't have the slightest clue how to arm lock and stuff like that... most likely i would of done the same and just beat the crap out of the thief... little punks deserve it |
|
|
| stealth |
quote:
Originally posted by arabian_ryda
me and my cuzins broke some guys legs and a couple of ribs after he robbed our burger joint in the summer we used a broom and a 2 by 4 and we never got charged. its all comes down to what u say to the cops we told them we only used the broom and that we only hit him 7 times but like the guy in the story he told the cops he used a stick of some sort but it was dark he could of said something else and gotten away with it.
:bthumbup:
don't worry i recovered fully, just playin.
If i found out who jacked me or seen them, trust me they would be hospitalized. |
|
|
| SHIFT_AT_9000_RPMS |
quote:
Originally posted by stealth
:bthumbup:
don't worry i recovered fully, just playin.
If i found out who jacked me or seen them, trust me they would be hospitalized.
I took it back cause you didn't pay me for it!! :thefinger |
|
|
| stealth |
| ahha, u want me to take ur ass also? |
|
|
| POX |
| you think wiht the car theift problems in edmonton they would be more linent wiht this stuff |
|
|
| 1mns13 |
| Vigilante action is the help cops need. A society that charges a person for protecting thier property is headed for ruin. Why is it some people's right to be a criminal? If a cop is hurt while doing his job, the criminal is a very bad person, if it happens the other way why do we look at the cops as bad. If a person is breaking the law, they should get whatever they get. |
|
|
| TrevorK |
quote:
Originally posted by 1mns13
Vigilante action is the help cops need. A society that charges a person for protecting thier property is headed for ruin. Why is it some people's right to be a criminal? If a cop is hurt while doing his job, the criminal is a very bad person, if it happens the other way why do we look at the cops as bad. If a person is breaking the law, they should get whatever they get.
I'm all for vigilante justice.
But there is a downside - you are innocent until proven guilty. And if you open up the doors, people will say "I think it was him" when they have no proof other than their intuition.
And I'm sure we've all been told we did something we actually didn't because emotions really impair judgement (Think wives/girlfriends when they suspect you cheat on them). |
|
|
| Inzane |
quote:
Originally posted by 1mns13
If a person is breaking the law, they should get whatever they get.
Disagree with this last statement. The punishment HAS to fit the crime. Yeah theft of property is a bad thing, but it doesn't warrant something like possible permanent facial disfigurement. |
|
|
| SplineZ |
I think the criminals should get what they deserve, but it should fit their crime.
a beating would be apropriate, but damaging an eye socket is a touch much. A nose and jaw would be acceptable, mind you they are all pretty close together..
I cant say I blame him for beating that crook down. I would have had a seriously hard time restraining myself if i found some bastard trying to break into my car...
James Z |
|
|
| Flex |
if a person is gonna steal they deserve whats coming to them.....if they get beat down a little rough....well they will think twice before doing that again.
What if that guy didnt get a beating...didnt learn his lesson....and next thing hes breaking into someones house and catching the people sleeping and lays the beat down on an elderly couple...that turn out to be your grandparents |
|
|
| GeoffDonk |
| I'd have bent the bastards knees the wrong way, and left him on the driveway till the cops came. |
|
|
| 1mns13 |
quote:
Originally posted by Flex
if a person is gonna steal they deserve whats coming to them.....if they get beat down a little rough....well they will think twice before doing that again.
What if that guy didnt get a beating...didnt learn his lesson....and next thing hes breaking into someones house and catching the people sleeping and lays the beat down on an elderly couple...that turn out to be your grandparents
That's exactly my point. Why does our society allow people to get to that point? when is enough enough? Many times thieves are like predators hoping to prey on the weak, sometimes who they think is weak isn't. They deserve the surprise they get. |
|
|
| BlueTurboEGG |
quote:
Originally posted by Flex
Someone was talking about restraining the person with arm bars and leg locks and such. Ya thats a great idea but not everyone knows that kinda thing. Also we have no idea of the size of the criminal. Im not gonna approach some monster with out something in my hands. And I tell you I would call the cops right away but I couldnt stand by and watch my property being stolen......could you???
We have a bat under our bed and as I work out of town I told my gf if anyone ever breaks in the house lock the bedroom door and call the cops and if that door opens and any body part pokes thru the door dont stop hitting it with the bat til it quits moving. I'd rather be battleing an assault charge in court then her fighting for her life in a hospital bed.
With a good lawyer he should be ok
I defenitely would not stand by. But I wouldn't beat down the guy either.
The situation you posed is TOTALLY different.
We're talking about ambushing a theif from behind. B&E, there is a genuine fear of horrible things that can be done to the occupants therefore the response to a life threatening situation is different.
But in that situation there are a few things to consider, your GF may fear for her life, but is she really prepared to clobber another human being into a bright red pulp?.
My personal motto is to never draw/brandish/expose a weapon I am not prepared to use and how to weild it properly because it could be turned against you.
Perhaps you could teach her how to swing it effectively against an attacker ;) I've seen people who have hte rough idea, but just can't seem to use the right application of strength in the swing. A few minutes of instruction fixed that right up.
Now before you go saying "It's a bat, how hard can that be?" some people in this world are not metally prepared "take a bat to another person" You may be able to do it, but there are those who have never considered it.
quote:
Originally posted by Kiddo
i don't know about you guys but i don't have the slightest clue how to arm lock and stuff like that... most likely i would of done the same and just beat the crap out of the thief... little punks deserve it
Then if you feel/fear the need to defend yourself, educate yourself, otherwise, get ready for a lengthy and *costly* legal battle.
The more educated you are reflects in your decisions and ultimately, easier to prove in court that you showed restraint rather than a desire give someone a beat down.
If you'd like, come and see me at the EDMA show at the V8less booth on Sat and Sun afternoon after 1pm, I'll be more than happy to show you a few simple yet effective control techniques. |
|
|
| BlueTurboEGG |
quote:
Originally posted by 1mns13
That's exactly my point. Why does our society allow people to get to that point? when is enough enough?
That Jared, is a million dollar question. |
|
|
| Flex |
quote:
Originally posted by BlueTurboEGG
I defenitely would not stand by. But I wouldn't beat down the guy either.
The situation you posed is TOTALLY different.
We're talking about ambushing a theif from behind. B&E, there is a genuine fear of horrible things that can be done to the occupants therefore the response to a life threatening situation is different.
But in that situation there are a few things to consider, your GF may fear for her life, but is she really prepared to clobber another human being into a bright red pulp?.
My personal motto is to never draw/brandish/expose a weapon I am not prepared to use and how to weild it properly because it could be turned against you.
Perhaps you could teach her how to swing it effectively against an attacker ;) I've seen people who have hte rough idea, but just can't seem to use the right application of strength in the swing. A few minutes of instruction fixed that right up.
Now before you go saying "It's a bat, how hard can that be?" some people in this world are not metally prepared "take a bat to another person" You may be able to do it, but there are those who have never considered it.
Then if you feel/fear the need to defend yourself, educate yourself, otherwise, get ready for a lengthy and *costly* legal battle.
The more educated you are reflects in your decisions and ultimately, easier to prove in court that you showed restraint rather than a desire give someone a beat down.
The situations may be different, but the criminals may be the same. One day breaking into cars, the next breaking into your house. In my opinion crime is crime and it makes me mad when I work my ass off to have nice things and some a-hole decides he wants it. In a situation where some one is breaking into my car.......ya I would stop them, ya there gonna get it but Im not gonna kill them over it. Someone comes in my house and they better be prepared to take one hell of a beating though. And ya my gf knows how to use the bat.....and ya shes prepared to use it if nessecary.
As for the court battle....I've said it before....I would rather be fighting a court battle then my gf in the hospital fighting for her life. |
|
|
| 1mns13 |
quote:
Originally posted by Flex
As for the court battle....I've said it before....I would rather be fighting a court battle then my gf/or wife in the hospital fighting for her life.
I agree, although the justice departments in North America don't.
The enforcement divisions may be on our side, but they don't make the laws they have to follow. |
|
|
| colossus |
| On this topic I found out that three ppl i know had their cars boken into this past 2 weeks. Everyone keep an eye out, bloody thieves are out and about with the warm weather. I think if a different officer responded in that case, there would not have been such charges. For pete sake the thief has no credibility when he is engaged in breaking the law. If he succeeds that will only encourage and increase further criminality. Police need to protect the honest citizens, not the criminals.:lol: |
|
|
| 1mns13 |
| Does everybody remember the owner of Audio 5.1? He was chharged for defending his property. WTF is wrong with this society? Do judges heads have to roll before decent citizens can defend and protect themselves? |
|
|
| stealth |
Personally, if you are on my property, trying to steal my hard earned cash(vehicle). I will beat the fuck out of you, end of story. Although I am only 16, I woulnt run up and be like "hey you wanna steal my shit lets fight!" I would just run up with my bat or crow bar, knock him hard in the knees, and hit him in the head knocking him out.
I dont feel sorry for that criminal at all, they need to understand when your property/family is in danger, do what you need to protect it, im sure the judge wouldnt be like, o someone is robbing me, i better do nothing, and call the cops, they should be here in 1 hour or 2, and solve my problems.... |
|
|
| Mekanik22 |
| I dunno about all this legal stuff. A car load of people where doing burnouts and revving their engines by my house at 4:00 in the morning on a tuesday night and my mom went out there and politely asked them to leave. Well they all got out of the car and threatened her and swore at her. She came inside and got my dad. My dad went out just pissed right off and a couple people got weapons out of the trunk like bats, 2x4's, you name it. Well they came at him with it and he punched one guy in the face instantly breaking his nose and my dad definetly had a size advantage, these people were really small asians. So he was out cold and another guy came from behind and hit him with the 2x4 and he stumbled a bit but turned around, punched him in the stomach and kicked him in the face with his steel toed boots. A third individual cut my dad in the ear with a sharp object (still unknown) and when my dad turned around, the guy ran away down the block. So there were 2 more guys who kinda backed away because they didn't want to get hurt I guess. But they picked up the 2 individuals and put them in the car and sped off and the police got called. About 3 hours later, a different car came and people got out and they smashed the taillight and endgate of my dad's truck and then threw a tire iron through our window. Then they sped away for the last and final time. The police got to my house shortly after and got the report and all that and my dad was never charged with anything and 3 individuals were convicted after one of the cars used was found at a 7-11 with a broken off tire. A book inside revealed lists and lists of names and they were tracked down and arrested. So is this all acceptable when it comes down to what they tried to do to my dad or did he use "excessive force"? |
|
|
| 1mns13 |
| Your dad did what he could, but maybe should have allowed them to continue disturbing the peace rather than get beat up in an unfair fight. Many against one usually only works in the movies. |
|
|
| Mekanik22 |
quote:
Originally posted by 1mns13
Many against one usually only works in the movies.
Well obviously this wasn't the case. My dad is one tough guy and has been through quite alot. He's pretty big and these were tiny asians that attacked him. Only 3 to be exact and he was able to take them out with 1 or 2 hits, the size difference is so great that I think he probably could have kept taking these guys on until someone had something that would disable anyone (gun, knife, etc...) |
|
|
| 2003specv |
I don't like fighting because you never know which asshole has a gun. Unless you're going to walk up to someone breaking into your car and plan on pulling your peice, and using it, don't bother. Just let insurance handle it.
Say you kick his knees out or take them out with a bat. Buddy falls to the ground, pulls a little .22 from his jacket and you're in the hospital or worse.
Although, in the heat of the moment I'd probably put a hole in the guy with my trusty katana. :D |
|
|
| quadraphonic |
| The question is, why didn't you help your dad?? You should've been out there to lay into some of those fools. |
|
|
| REDX2NV |
quote:
Originally posted by Mekanik22
I dunno about all this legal stuff. A car load of people where doing burnouts and revving their engines by my house at 4:00 in the morning on a tuesday night and my mom went out there and politely asked them to leave. Well they all got out of the car and threatened her and swore at her. She came inside and got my dad. My dad went out just pissed right off and a couple people got weapons out of the trunk like bats, 2x4's, you name it. Well they came at him with it and he punched one guy in the face instantly breaking his nose and my dad definetly had a size advantage, these people were really small asians. So he was out cold and another guy came from behind and hit him with the 2x4 and he stumbled a bit but turned around, punched him in the stomach and kicked him in the face with his steel toed boots. A third individual cut my dad in the ear with a sharp object (still unknown) and when my dad turned around, the guy ran away down the block. So there were 2 more guys who kinda backed away because they didn't want to get hurt I guess. But they picked up the 2 individuals and put them in the car and sped off and the police got called. About 3 hours later, a different car came and people got out and they smashed the taillight and endgate of my dad's truck and then threw a tire iron through our window. Then they sped away for the last and final time. The police got to my house shortly after and got the report and all that and my dad was never charged with anything and 3 individuals were convicted after one of the cars used was found at a 7-11 with a broken off tire. A book inside revealed lists and lists of names and they were tracked down and arrested. So is this all acceptable when it comes down to what they tried to do to my dad or did he use "excessive force"?
And this was in sherwood park?? And they had a list?? Grr, i'm going to have to sleep with one eye open now.. |
|
|
| iancaldeira |
Im actually surprised that this forum would post my problem in regards to the "excessive force" charge. I thought I would put my 2 cents in as I have been following the replies from both the SHOFORUM and this one.
First of all, just like anyone else that works hard to maintain thier rides and to get them to the point of being "yours" not like anyone elses, its hard to sit by and let assholes take something they dont deserve.
I think that theif was lucky he decided to try my car instead of my cousins home, cuz if he did, Im sure he would of incurred more bodily harm then what I have done to him.
Second, this thief wasnt a small guy. He was close to 6 ft. 3. Im 6 ft 245 lbs solid (except for my beer keg), and he threw the first punch. I was even somewhat controlled when I told him to stop what hes doing before he attacked me.
The lacrosse stick? Well, that was the first thing I could of grabbed instead of a knife. I figured that if this guy at least seen that I had a weapon, he wouldnt pull any shit. He made a mistake, and now he pays.
Am I for vigalante justice? Not really. In some circumstances though, you have to stand up for what is right. All I know now, is that every day this asshole looks into the mirror, and possibly sees hamburger instead of steak for a face, hell remember not to break the law.
Thirdly, in respects to the holds and arm bars. Ive taken Aikido for 4 years, and I know how to handle myself with or with out weapons. After a while of thinking about my actions, I know that yes I did step out of line in some respects on the beating I handed to him, but he kept on fighting, even when I had him pinned on the driveway.
Last point now, is that even though I never played the game of lacrosse, (Ive coached it for many years tho, but thats another story) I can now tell my players that when Im demonstrating the proper way to cross check, I REALLY KNOW HOW TO CROSS CHECK.
By the way, even though I drive a SHO, I still give my respects to those who spend thier time fixing up thier rides, and I would expect the same respect back. Peace.
Ian Caldeira;) |
|
|
| quadraphonic |
| I'm behind you Ian, I think you did the right thing. Let us know how things work out with the police. |
|
|
| POX |
| Ian, all i gota say is good work, and you must have a gaint amount of self controll... cause i dont konw if i would have been able to stop my self at a beating.. |
|
|
| BlueBlur |
quote:
Originally posted by iancaldeira
Im actually surprised that this forum would post my problem in regards to the "excessive force" charge. I thought I would put my 2 cents in as I have been following the replies from both the SHOFORUM and this one.
First of all, just like anyone else that works hard to maintain thier rides and to get them to the point of being "yours" not like anyone elses, its hard to sit by and let assholes take something they dont deserve.
I think that theif was lucky he decided to try my car instead of my cousins home, cuz if he did, Im sure he would of incurred more bodily harm then what I have done to him.
Second, this thief wasnt a small guy. He was close to 6 ft. 3. Im 6 ft 245 lbs solid (except for my beer keg), and he threw the first punch. I was even somewhat controlled when I told him to stop what hes doing before he attacked me.
The lacrosse stick? Well, that was the first thing I could of grabbed instead of a knife. I figured that if this guy at least seen that I had a weapon, he wouldnt pull any shit. He made a mistake, and now he pays.
Am I for vigalante justice? Not really. In some circumstances though, you have to stand up for what is right. All I know now, is that every day this asshole looks into the mirror, and possibly sees hamburger instead of steak for a face, hell remember not to break the law.
Thirdly, in respects to the holds and arm bars. Ive taken Aikido for 4 years, and I know how to handle myself with or with out weapons. After a while of thinking about my actions, I know that yes I did step out of line in some respects on the beating I handed to him, but he kept on fighting, even when I had him pinned on the driveway.
Last point now, is that even though I never played the game of lacrosse, (Ive coached it for many years tho, but thats another story) I can now tell my players that when Im demonstrating the proper way to cross check, I REALLY KNOW HOW TO CROSS CHECK.
By the way, even though I drive a SHO, I still give my respects to those who spend thier time fixing up thier rides, and I would expect the same respect back. Peace.
Ian Caldeira;)
Ian;
First, I'd like to say good on ya for catching the bastid.
With martial training, I'm actually surprised that you didn't do more damage.
You showed remarkable restraint.
I'm curious as to the "charge" is it excessive force used to restrain or just assault?
Isn't "excessive force" term reserved for someone in a position of sanctioned autority? (i.e. police officers?)
If this person was attempting to get into your house, would there even be a charge?
What if you had a wife and children? How would you react then?
If I were in that position, I know I'd be disabling the fu#kbag not just restraining.
A couple of questions:
Did the thief press charges or did the police take it upon themselves to charge you?
How long after did they show up?
* Please keep us informed as to what's going on with your dealings with the justice system.
I can't speak for others, but I know I'm behind you on this. |
|
|
| MightyMidget |
hmm interesting.....I have one word for everyone ARTICULATE!!! its all how you describe the situation and what your actions were......just like that joke,......how many police officers does it take to push a suspect down the stairs??? NONE, he fell ;)
S |
|
|
| Flex |
Ian,
I think you did it right....I couldnt stand by and let someone steal or damage my property or worse hurt someone close to me. And if you are gonna get charged in this thats total BS. Im my days of working security we sometimes used force to hold people and of course everyone cried abuse. And we were always told by our boss (who was an ex cop) the same thing mighty midget is saying its all in how you present the story. The cops arent your friends and you never tell them nothing.
And one big thing is to say "you were in fear for your life or safety" and if they try to give you the BS about how big you are that means nothing they are just trying to turn things around. Anyone can be in fear for their safety. Also keep it hush hush about having martial arts training....that will only hurt your cause.
And yes please let us know how far this goes. |
|
|
| Xpnsve |
| Thats BS, shoulda curb-stomped his ass! |
|
|
| Insomniac |
Hey, i got a tip.
Since there is a legal battle going on, don't say anything about it on a public forum.
That's all. |
|
|
| BlueTurboEGG |
quote:
Originally posted by iancaldeira
Im actually surprised that this forum would post my problem in regards to the "excessive force" charge. I thought I would put my 2 cents in as I have been following the replies from both the SHOFORUM and this one.
First of all, just like anyone else that works hard to maintain thier rides and to get them to the point of being "yours" not like anyone elses, its hard to sit by and let assholes take something they dont deserve.
I think that theif was lucky he decided to try my car instead of my cousins home, cuz if he did, Im sure he would of incurred more bodily harm then what I have done to him.
Second, this thief wasnt a small guy. He was close to 6 ft. 3. Im 6 ft 245 lbs solid (except for my beer keg), and he threw the first punch. I was even somewhat controlled when I told him to stop what hes doing before he attacked me.
The lacrosse stick? Well, that was the first thing I could of grabbed instead of a knife. I figured that if this guy at least seen that I had a weapon, he wouldnt pull any shit. He made a mistake, and now he pays.
Am I for vigalante justice? Not really. In some circumstances though, you have to stand up for what is right. All I know now, is that every day this asshole looks into the mirror, and possibly sees hamburger instead of steak for a face, hell remember not to break the law.
Thirdly, in respects to the holds and arm bars. Ive taken Aikido for 4 years, and I know how to handle myself with or with out weapons. After a while of thinking about my actions, I know that yes I did step out of line in some respects on the beating I handed to him, but he kept on fighting, even when I had him pinned on the driveway.
Last point now, is that even though I never played the game of lacrosse, (Ive coached it for many years tho, but thats another story) I can now tell my players that when Im demonstrating the proper way to cross check, I REALLY KNOW HOW TO CROSS CHECK.
By the way, even though I drive a SHO, I still give my respects to those who spend thier time fixing up thier rides, and I would expect the same respect back. Peace.
Ian Caldeira;)
Good to finally meet you Ian and hear it from the horses mouth, so to speak :)
You'd think that you're protecting your best interests by defending your property, but the way the world works, that is not so.
I realize it's easy for me to stand by and criticise your actions based on your post, it's easy to spend all the time in the world to pick apart a snap decision that occurs in a few seconds.
But I mean no disrepect, the sad reality that most people are not aware of is the legalities that can follow such an incident.
I hope things work out for you, do keep us informed of how things are progressing if time (and the law) allow. |
|
|
| 1mns13 |
| As BTE's signature might imply, dead man don't need lawyers, and certainly don't file charges. Maybe that's the message the justice dept. is trying to send. If thieves "disappear" it may be a better place? |
|
|
| k_mac501 |
| What is the real criminal being charged with? |
|
|
| Casanova |
quote:
Originally posted by Kiddo
i don't know about you guys but i don't have the slightest clue how to arm lock and stuff like that... most likely i would of done the same and just beat the crap out of the thief...
yah i agree. I would just go psycho on him to make sure he couldnt attack. |
|
|
| Casanova |
quote:
Originally posted by MightyMidget
how many police officers does it take to push a suspect down the stairs??? NONE, he fell ;)
S
or instead of stairs, an elevator shaft. |
|
|
| v8slayer |
The guy was stupid for calling the cops in the first place!
Quite simply the guy should just go missing.
Really , what is his family going to say. Officer my son is a thief and he was out stealing cars and must have got caught.
I have no idea what car or what area but he must have got caught.
Ya right, like anyone would say that!
Don't report the attempted theft on your car and take a one way trip out to the bushes.
End of story.
PS: Make sure you grab his spotter before you committ yourself to this action. |
|
|
| Mekanik22 |
quote:
Originally posted by v8slayer
The guy was stupid for calling the cops in the first place!
Quite simply the guy should just go missing.
Really , what is his family going to say. Officer my son is a thief and he was out stealing cars and must have got caught.
I have no idea what car or what area but he must have got caught.
Ya right, like anyone would say that!
Don't report the attempted theft on your car and take a one way trip out to the bushes.
End of story.
PS: Make sure you grab his spotter before you committ yourself to this action.
Then with the forensic science they have and people being in "odd" places (discovering the body), it eventually gets back to you and then you get to go to prison for 2nd degree murder. |
|
|
| Insomniac |
ha ha, no seriously, what is the guy gonna do, complain to the police that he was trying to steal a car and got his ass kicked. No.
don't take slayer seriously about killing the guy, but do take his advice not to call the cops seriously |
|
|
| BlueTurboEGG |
quote:
Originally posted by Casanova
yah i agree. I would just go psycho on him to make sure he couldnt attack.
Then YOU should ask someone who knows how :D
I sort of agree with the statement about not calling the cops.
Here's something else to consider: This thug you just let go also knows where you live, or at the very least, where someone you know lives.
As sure as rain in a rain storm, he's gonna come back for some revenge for past "humiliation"
Criminals don't report to the police. |
|
|
| iancaldeira |
Well, today was a good day I must say. The charges was officially dropped as of this morning. No court date, no time off work, more money more money more money!:cool:
If you guys are driving around the Edmonton area, keep an eye out for me. Im not hard to miss. I drive a red taurus SHO with gold accents and black tint all around.
Thanks for the support guys, it means alot. Cya on the streets! |
|
|
| BlueTurboEGG |
| Good to hear Ian :) |
|
|
| BlueBlur |
Excellent to hear!
I hope you also told the police that he damaged your Lacrosse stick.
:blink: |
|
|
|
