| 300zxgal |
Im ahving some problems with the z.
To sum it up, it wont start once it gets warm. First thing in the morning it starts, or if its been sitting somewhere cool it will start as many times as you want it to. but again once it starts running.. its turning over, but not starting.
I've replaced the ignition module, as well as the spark plugs.
You can hear the fuel pump, so that isn't dead. And Right now i'm fairly pissed off at the thing.
Other thing its doing (which it didn't do until i got the valve cover gasket replaced as well as having that shit boost controller removed) is almost stalling out whenever you floor the gas pedal from a stop. It has never stalled out, but threatens to.. rpms drop to zero, and then it kicks in.
Otherwise the car runs strong.
I dunno.. any ideas
and jason this is what i was trying to PM you, but since ur mailbox is full :)
any input would be appreciated guys thanks
-Kris |
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| MixManMash |
Try running the ECU diagnostic and see what codes it throws back at ya.
La-Z-Link
Once you do this, you should be able to narrow down the list of possibilities. |
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| Inzane |
quote:
Originally posted by 300zxgal
it wont start once it gets warm. First thing in the morning it starts, or if its been sitting somewhere cool it will start as many times as you want it to.
Since it does start cold, but not when warm, there are certain common elements you can ignore for the time being, and focus on the *unique* suspects for a warm start problem.
In the order to check:
- leaking injectors (seperate from injector function)
- EGR valve (does it stick open or closed?)
- check timing belt (was it aligned properly when installed?)
quote:
Other thing its doing (which it didn't do until i got the valve cover gasket replaced as well as having that shit boost controller removed) is almost stalling out whenever you floor the gas pedal from a stop. It has never stalled out, but threatens to.. rpms drop to zero, and then it kicks in.
That one is interesting because according to the FSM there are several suspects that are common to a stalling problem AND your starting problem, but *should* also be affecting cold start as well, not just a warm start. Hmm...
Anyways, those common elements are:
- fuel injectors (try the ohm test)
- ignition spark (you said new spark plugs, but check their gap, and check your coilpacks)
- fuel pressure (you said the pump is fine, check/replace your fuel filter, check your FPR and dampner).
- ECM harness connector (damaged terminals, seated properly?) |
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| 300zxgal |
| Okay, ran the ECU Diagnostic, Throws the 34 Code which leads to the knock sensor. Low boost/safety boost whatever right. But doesnt throw anything else.. ie why the hell my car wont start :dunno: |
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| ~30oZ~ |
| I have a million answers for you if the car had problems starting when cold...but not starting when warm...I can't figure it out. If I had to guess I would guess leaking injectors.:dunno: |
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| MixManMash |
| That's the problem. There are so many variables... I think the FSM has some flow charts to follow. I'll take a look later. |
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| MixManMash |
quote:
Originally posted by 300zxgal
Okay, ran the ECU Diagnostic, Throws the 34 Code which leads to the knock sensor. Low boost/safety boost whatever right. But doesnt throw anything else.. ie why the hell my car wont start :dunno:
OK, that won't explain why your car doesn't start when warm.
However, you should consider checking the connection to the knock sensor (i.e. knock sensor harness). If it is corroded, clean it out and check again later for code 34. If you have to replace the knock sensor (I had to), it's a PITA. It's located in such an ugly place that I decided to relocate mine to one of the plenum bolts at the back.
Please note that a code 34 doesn't just put the car into safety boost but it also cuts back timing and runs the car in the low octane map (runs it a little richer). You will find that the car drives completely different when it's not throwing a code 34. It will definitely feel more responsive and powerful (not just because of the boost, but moreso because of the timing and fuel map).
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| Inzane |
quote:
Originally posted by MixManMash
I'll take a look later.
I already gave her the info from the FSM above. It doesn't sound like she tried any of that yet.
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| MixManMash |
quote:
Originally posted by Inzane
I already gave her the info from the FSM above. It doesn't sound like she tried any of that yet.
Yeah, I know you did, but I was specifically going to find the flow chart for diagnosing, if there even is one in the FSM. |
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| Inzane |
quote:
Originally posted by MixManMash
but I was specifically going to find the flow chart for diagnosing, if there even is one in the FSM.
Yes there is one. And what I did is I picked out the items from it that were specific to warm (normal) start conditions and left out the items that were common to both cold AND warm starting problems.
When you remove all the common ones you are left with:
- leaking injectors
- EGR valve
- timing belt installed properly?
I've left them in the correct order to diagnose (from more likely to less likely) as well. |
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| McFly |
the hesitation when hitting the gas could be a misalligned TPS.
my gtr did that gor a while:dunno:
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| MixManMash |
quote:
Originally posted by Inzane
Yes there is one. And what I did is I picked out the items from it that were specific to warm (normal) start conditions and left out the items that were common to both cold AND warm starting problems.
When you remove all the common ones you are left with:
- leaking injectors
- EGR valve
- timing belt installed properly?
I've left them in the correct order to diagnose (from more likely to less likely) as well.
Ok then. I was just going to look for more detailed diagnostic procedures - i.e. what you do to diagnose those items listed. |
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| Inzane |
quote:
Originally posted by MixManMash
Ok then. I was just going to look for more detailed diagnostic procedures - i.e. what you do to diagnose those items listed.
Well, go ahead if you like. That would be a lot of typing though, unless you want to scan it. :p
As I'm sure 300zxgal knows, a FSM for herself should be on her to-purchase list so she doesn't have to rely on others every time to relay this kind of info to her. |
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| MixManMash |
quote:
Originally posted by Inzane
Well, go ahead if you like. That would be a lot of typing though, unless you want to scan it. :p
As I'm sure 300zxgal knows, a FSM for herself should be on her to-purchase list so she doesn't have to rely on others every time to relay this kind of info to her.
Yes, good point - that would be a lot of typing. And there is no need to scan if you have an electronic copy of the manual (which I just happend to have). Or you can always provide a La-Z-Link to the online manual page with the flow chart. :p |
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| Inzane |
quote:
Originally posted by MixManMash
Or you can always provide a La-Z-Link to the online manual page with the flow chart. :p
Haha... close.
She said "warm", which IF I interpreted the manual correctly was the "hard to start while normal" (not cold, not hot) condition. It was that one that I used as a starting point. |
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| MixManMash |
quote:
Originally posted by Inzane
Haha... close.
She said "warm", which IF I interpreted the manual correctly was the "hard to start while normal" (not cold, not hot) condition. It was that one that I used as a starting point.
lol. close enough. Flip 2 more pages or La-Z-Link #2
Slow day at the office? |
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| 300zxgal |
holy crap!
lol Thanks for taking an interest guys i really appreciate it!
matt and i will be doing some checking. LOl that 'to purchase' list just keeping getting long er and longer hey. We're doing the knock sensor relocation, and replacing it at the same time.. so part of the problem hopefully is fixed.
as for the starting.. leaking injectors and coil packs are next on the list |
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| MixManMash |
quote:
Originally posted by 300zxgal
holy crap!
She says after looking at the kajillion posts since her last one. lol.
It's all good.
Good luck!!!
BTW, what do you mean you are relocating and replacing the knock sensor? I left my old one in there (there is no way I was going to pull 50% of the top end apart to get in there; even though I was 25% of the way there - long story, maybe on a different day) and just purchased a new knock sensor and harness and located it somewhere else, somewhere more readily accessible. |
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| 300zxgal |
quote:
Originally posted by MixManMash
...just purchased a new knock sensor and harness and located it somewhere else, somewhere more readily accessible.
Yes taht is what i meant that i am doin
and yeah kajillion posts :) |
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| Inzane |
quote:
Originally posted by MixManMash
located it somewhere else, somewhere more readily accessible.
How do you know it can still do the same job in a different location? If you move the pick-up location, won't the noises it senses be different? |
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| 300zxgal |
The location is similar, but in a more readily accessable area Twin Turbo.Net Article
is where i have got some of my information for the relocation |
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| 300zxgal |
and the starting thing has been upgraded from not only when its been running previously.. to hardly ever..
ill get a good start.. once a day.. if its been cool.. and if the stars are in alignment.
Another question:
Squeeling noise in the rear during idle. Fuel pump possibly? |
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| MixManMash |
quote:
Originally posted by Inzane
How do you know it can still do the same job in a different location? If you move the pick-up location, won't the noises it senses be different?
Frankly, I don't know and I really didn't feel like taking a whole chunk of the car out to get at it. But I have it relocated and it did kick in when it had too. I heard a slight bit of detonation on the highway on my way back from Calgary on Saturday. Sure enough, it kicked in right away and cut out my boost controller (remember, I have a relay kicking out my boost controller if the ECU wants to go into safety boost). And the timing did get kicked back.
I have it relocated to the rear of the engine and it is bolted through one of the plenum bolts (which hopefully should pick up any detonation). Plus it's right at the back where cylinder 5 and 6 are. IIRC, 5 and 6 are the ones that seem to detonate the most (partially because of a certain extra flashing in the cast that doesn't get as much coolant to the back).
With that said, if and when I pull the motor for a build job / turbo upgrade / whatever else I pull it for, I will likely put it in the stock location with lots of dielectric grease to protect the contacts and the ground connection. |
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| MixManMash |
quote:
Originally posted by 300zxgal
and the starting thing has been upgraded from not only when its been running previously.. to hardly ever..
ill get a good start.. once a day.. if its been cool.. and if the stars are in alignment.
Another question:
Squeeling noise in the rear during idle. Fuel pump possibly?
Not good. You might as well add this La-Z-Link to the other flow charts to go through.
The squeeling noise in the rear during idle could be a fuel pump or it could be the antenna from the stereo (mine did that when it was partially broken). |
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| 300zxgal |
mm.. not antenna i know what that noise is.. lol
yay lazlink |
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| Inzane |
quote:
Originally posted by 300zxgal
The location is similar, but in a more readily accessable area Twin Turbo.Net Article
is where i have got some of my information for the relocation
Yeah, I knew about that article. Nixit is a pretty reliable source for information. (LOL at his disclaimers... good that he included that). I haven't done that relocation myself (yet) because my detonation sensor hasn't given me any trouble. (hasn't even thrown a code in my recent memory either).
I was intending to put a new detonation sensor (among a zillion other new oem sensors, gaskets, etc.) on my shopping list when it comes time some day for a rebuild/swap.
I like the first location Nixit is showing where he has the sensor mounted at the rear of the head. That's where I'd probably put mine (when the time comes).
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| ~30oZ~ |
| I hope you find the problem!...but does this thread ever prove my point about JDM...*cough*...cars. lol:p I still say it's your injectors...:dunno: |
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| 300zxgal |
quote:
Originally posted by ~30oZ~
I hope you find the problem!...but does this thread ever prove my point about JDM...*cough*...cars. lol:p I still say it's your injectors...:dunno:
not jdms
300zx's
but theyre worth it for being so damn sexy!
funny story tho edwin.. ill tell ya later :D |
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| ~30oZ~ |
quote:
Originally posted by 300zxgal
not jdms
300zx's
but theyre worth it for being so damn sexy!
funny story tho edwin.. ill tell ya later :D
ya...ok...lol j/k what story!!!!????:eek: |
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| 95IntegraRS |
Well, we believed the starting problem to be ignition related initially. So I changed the Ignition Control Module as well as replaced the plugs. Started fine initially, but after sitting overnight it was having the same starting problems. Looked over the wiring, etc. before heading running an ECU diagnostics test on it and tight the ECU harness connections and cleared the code. After clearing the code, the engine starts perfectly and is running the proper boost (10.5 pounds). Still has a slight hesitation at low RPM when you jump onto the gas and seems to be running a tad rich. Still going to check the ohm's on the injectors as well as the coilpacks. See if that leads me anywhere.
I'm under the impression the start problem was from the code 34. As stated earlier, it runs less aggresive timing and rich fuel maps. I think that coupled with the fact that there is still an underlying fuel delivery issue was flooding the engine. Hence, starting after sitting for a period of time. I think now that the code has been cleared, the ECU is running in the proper mode and there is no longer the possibility of flooding the engine under startup.
I'd like to thank everyone for trying to lend a hand. Its all been very helpful. |
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| Inzane |
quote:
Originally posted by 95IntegraRS
is running the proper boost (10.5 pounds).
10.5 psi is actually more than "stock" boost, at least for a CDM/USDM car... not sure about JDM. Stock boost in our experience is normally ~ 9 psi +/- 0.5. (assuming bone stock, no breathing mods).
quote:
I'm under the impression the start problem was from the code 34.
I still fail to see a link between code 34 and starting issues. You could completely disconnect the detonation sensor and you should still be able to start the car.
quote:
I think that coupled with the fact that there is still an underlying fuel delivery issue was flooding the engine.
CHECK THOSE INJECTORS! I'd be concerned you've got leaking injectors. (especially given its in the diagnosis charts in the FSM for a warm start problem). |
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| 95IntegraRS |
Its got a catback exhaust system, hence the 10-10.5 pounds.
quote:
I still fail to see a link between code 34 and starting issues. You could completely disconnect the detonation sensor and you should still be able to start the car.
quote:
I'm under the impression the start problem was from the code 34. As stated earlier, it runs less aggresive timing and rich fuel maps. I think that coupled with the fact that there is still an underlying fuel delivery issue was flooding the engine
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| MixManMash |
quote:
Originally posted by Inzane
I still fail to see a link between code 34 and starting issues. You could completely disconnect the detonation sensor and you should still be able to start the car.
Agreed. Car should start fine with code 34. The measures the ECU takes by running less agressive timing and richer fuel map should never cause a starting issue and is more or less a precaution to avoid a situation in which the motor could potentially detonate but the ECU can't detect it. |
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| P_D |
| your starting problem might be with the ignigter coils, i had the same problem with mine and that what it turned out to be. |
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| 300zxgal |
quote:
Originally posted by P_D
your starting problem might be with the ignigter coils, i had the same problem with mine and that what it turned out to be.
that and the fuel pump.. might be for sale tho.. i cant really work on it by myself.. i need some help and guidance.. adn i dont realyl have that anymore
edit: fitting post count for my last post no? |
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| ~30oZ~ |
quote:
Originally posted by 300zxgal
i need some help and guidance.. adn i dont realyl have that anymore
Matt decided he's not going to work on the car anymore?:dunno: |
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