| stuka126 |
I am wondering if anyone would be able to give me some advice.
We were backing out of a stall in a parking lot, turning right (passenger side out to traffic) and a car came around the corner and basically drove down the bumper of my boyfriend's Integra.
We were already 3/4 the way out of the stall, ready to put it into drive when this happened. There were absolutely no cars parked next to us and the sun was facing the other way. It's like the lady didn't even care or see us or who knows what.
So isn't parking lots 50/50 fault? I have heard that its false but also that it's true.
See she took at least 4 car lengths to stop, and her entire passenger side of her car is scratched to hell and dented. The corner of our bumper (RH) is dented in, so the physics tell you that we were far enough out that she shouldn't have hit us. We also have 2 witnesses, one who saw the entire thing happen and thinks it was her fault. There were police reports filed and the whole 9 yards, so everything was done right.
Here's my problem....our insurance didn't bother to call us until today (over a month later) and told us we are 100% at fault, admitted he did not contact our witnesses, he said there was no point. He basically wanted nothing to do with us, he wouldn't even answer our calls all month. We heard from the OTHER insurance before our own!! There hasn't even been an insurance agent look at the vehicles, ours at least. And we've been calling them practically every day! Our quote is over $1000, I can only imagine hers. So what do you all think, do you think we should be looking into legal advice or will we just lose?? I looked everywhere and I can't find parking lot laws anywhere!!!!!!
HELP!!!
email is daylestar@hotmail.com or post on here thx
:bowdown: :bowdown: |
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| dtjohnst |
I can't speak on insurance, but as far as the law goes, parking lots are the same as any street. The Traffic Safety Act says:
quote:
“highway” means any thoroughfare, street, road, trail, avenue, parkway, driveway, viaduct, lane, alley, square, bridge, causeway, trestleway or other place or any part of any of them, whether publicly or privately owned, that the public is ordinarily entitled or permitted to use for the passage or parking of vehicles and includes
(i) a sidewalk, including a boulevard adjacent to the sidewalk,
(ii) if a ditch lies adjacent to and parallel with the roadway, the ditch, and
(iii) if a highway right of way is contained between fences or between a fence and one side of the roadway, all the land between the fences, or all the land between the fence and the edge of the roadway, as the case may be,
but does not include a place declared by regulation not to be a highway
Unfortunately, there aren't any regulations outlining the situation you're talking about. You should only back up when safe to do so, but she should also be paying attention and yielding right of way if required.
You can try to fight if you want, but insurance companies have good lawyers and it might not work out for you. If your witness claims you weren't at fault, that's something that will help you in court. Did the police reports give an opinion on who was at fault?
Regardless the outcome, it might be time to find a new insurance company, because that's BS. |
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| Vive le Quebec |
Parking lots must follow the TSA since they're technically part of a public highway (since they can be accessed freely by anyone)...doesn't matter that they're owned by Walmart or BestBuy.
My advice...call a lawyer...unless dtjohnst has some advice...he seems to know everything. This is one issue I am clueless about and don't want to make any recommendations that may put you in a position that may otherwise be financially crippling. |
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| Vive le Quebec |
| Ahhhhh...this is so funny...my post should have come before dtjohnsts...otherwise it doesn't make sense. Notice the time stamps! I was typing mine at the same time I guess :dunno: ? |
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| dtjohnst |
quote:
Originally posted by Vive le Quebec
Parking lots must follow the TSA since they're technically part of a public highway (since they can be accessed freely by anyone)...doesn't matter that they're owned by Walmart or BestBuy.
My advice...call a lawyer...unless dtjohnst has some advice...he seems to know everything. This is one issue I am clueless about and don't want to make any recommendations that may put you in a position that may otherwise be financially crippling.
lol I don't know everything. I just tend to keep my mouth shut when I don't know. The problem is, neither of you, and yet both of you, could be defined as being "at fault". A witness could swing it one way or the other, but worst case I think it'd be 50/50 for you. The problem is, like I said, I don't know the insurance game, just the law since my training was more related to intepretation instead of just memorization. Afterall, when we ship off somewhere, we need to learn the laws of that place and they can't afford drawn out courses for every 2 or 3 week tasking we might ever go on.
EDIT: Looks like we managed the same-time post again. |
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| stuka126 |
Yah we are definitly looking for another insurance company..my car was stolen in March and it took them 5 days to honor my "loss of use" clause in my insurance and get me a rental..and this was during my final exams in college and i work too.
man was i pissed, and this is the last straw. by the way we are with wawanesa...
i think we may be screwed... :mad:
the police man who took the reports said it seemed like a 50/50 accident, and the lady even was like "well i don't know who's fault it was" and was acting really guilty, even the witnesses were like, "yah it's her fault"....
:drama: |
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| dtjohnst |
quote:
Originally posted by stuka126
Yah we are definitly looking for another insurance company..my car was stolen in March and it took them 5 days to honor my "loss of use" clause in my insurance and get me a rental..and this was during my final exams in college and i work too.
man was i pissed, and this is the last straw. by the way we are with wawanesa...
i think we may be screwed... :mad:
the police man who took the reports said it seemed like a 50/50 accident, and the lady even was like "well i don't know who's fault it was" and was acting really guilty, even the witnesses were like, "yah it's her fault"....
:drama:
As a fellow driver, I'm appalled. I will say that if I was in your shoes, I would probably hire a lawyer. It seems like you have enough reson and witnesses to back you up and get at least 50/50. Bear in mind, that's not the opinion of dtjohnst the ex-law enforcement officer, merely that of dtjohnst the fellow citizen. |
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| stuka126 |
Thanks for the advice..
I do realize that this is not offical legal advice or anything of the sort, just opinions.
But we've never been in an accident and we have no clue why the insurance is treating us this way, so I wonder if it has to do with the other insurance company.
Anyways, we'll see what we can do I guess..
Thanks for the advice everyone |
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| TrevorK |
quote:
Originally posted by stuka126
the police man who took the reports said it seemed like a 50/50 accident,
Remember, the police officer has no direct bearing on what the insurance companies decision is as to fault.
About all he can do is issue tickets, which have an impact as to who is at fault. But without issuing a ticket, the police officer doesn't have a huge impact (Unless his report contains something out of the ordinary). |
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| stuka126 |
| no..unfortunately no tickets issued b/c the accident seemed minor, we just drove to the station with the other car and driver. |
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| dtjohnst |
quote:
Originally posted by TrevorK
Remember, the police officer has no direct bearing on what the insurance companies decision is as to fault.
About all he can do is issue tickets, which have an impact as to who is at fault. But without issuing a ticket, the police officer doesn't have a huge impact (Unless his report contains something out of the ordinary).
But if you take the insurance company to court because you disagree with their decision, a police report would be good evidence to have with you. |
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| TrevorK |
quote:
Originally posted by dtjohnst
But if you take the insurance company to court because you disagree with their decision, a police report would be good evidence to have with you.
Absolutely.
But if you have enough evidence that you feel you'll win in court, why would the insurance company spend $4000 to fight your $1000 claim? |
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| Ayeso |
| Because its not jsut 1000$ thats the dmg to their car, but the other persons car will need to be paid for as well, but whos insurance, well he was foudn at fault so its his company that pays for it. |
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| dtjohnst |
quote:
Originally posted by TrevorK
Absolutely.
But if you have enough evidence that you feel you'll win in court, why would the insurance company spend $4000 to fight your $1000 claim?
The insurance company didn't speak to any witnesses and didn't read the police report. You're making it sound like they have some ace up their sleeve. That ace is good lawyers, but if everyone agrees that it was 50/50 or the other driver was at fault, it seems to me they haven't really looked into things. THey haven't even looked at his car for crying out loud. It seems to me if it goes to court that they'd be the ones woefully unprepared.
Besides, maybe at the first sign he'll fight them they'll back down, look into things and take his side. Regardless, he wanted to know if he was at fault, and the best way to answer that is to know what the police said after their investigation since the insurance company hasn't bothered. |
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| stuka126 |
Seems strange how the insurance doesn't want to look into things. They called this morning (1st time they returned our call yet!) and my bf asked what the damage to the other car would be, and our insurance adjustor said he didn't know.
He also said if we just straight paid the damage to the other vehicle, our premiums would STILL be affected regardless of whether or not we claimed through insurance. That seems weird that our premium would increase even if we paid it out of our own pocket.....
I told my bf to see about talking to a more senior adjustor but he hasn't had a chance yet.....we've been really patient through this whole thing and yesterday when my bf called and they offered (yet again) to take a message, he told them what's the point he won't call anyways and hung up, and apparently that's what it takes to get a returned phone call b/c he phoned us first thing this morning....maybe he feels like he can just push us around and that's why he didn't bother looking into the details...
Can't wait till this is over so we can switch insurance companies..... |
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| Vive le Quebec |
quote:
Originally posted by stuka126
Seems strange how the insurance doesn't want to look into things. They called this morning (1st time they returned our call yet!) and my bf asked what the damage to the other car would be, and our insurance adjustor said he didn't know.
He also said if we just straight paid the damage to the other vehicle, our premiums would STILL be affected regardless of whether or not we claimed through insurance. That seems weird that our premium would increase even if we paid it out of our own pocket.....
I told my bf to see about talking to a more senior adjustor but he hasn't had a chance yet.....we've been really patient through this whole thing and yesterday when my bf called and they offered (yet again) to take a message, he told them what's the point he won't call anyways and hung up, and apparently that's what it takes to get a returned phone call b/c he phoned us first thing this morning....maybe he feels like he can just push us around and that's why he didn't bother looking into the details...
Can't wait till this is over so we can switch insurance companies.....
man it's incidents like these that piss me off. what the fuck is an insurance company for if you have to pay for shit out of your own pockets. the purpose of insurance is a pool paid into by a large group of people "in-case-shit"...and now that "in-case-shit" happened you should have every right to use that without penalty given that these circumstances indicate you didn't act out of stupidity or ignorance. what a bunch of fuckheads...thanks for at least informing us which company NOT to go with. |
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| Bad Egg |
I had the same kind of "help" from my insurance co. in a parking lot crash. The just flat out told me that the other guy's insurer had insisted it was my fault and the two companies were going to split the costs down the middle. I said fu, since I only had PLPD, and filed a small claims suit.
It turned out his insurer didn't even look at the case, they had farmed it out to a contract adjuster who hadn't even taken a look at the accident details. When they got dinged with the suit, they sent a senior adjustor out who promptly saw things my way, admitted their guy was 100% at fault, and paid for my repairs and a rental car.
My insurer did zip for me, and my actions saved them a couple of thousand bucks. I ditched the clowns shortly afterwards.
You may not be so fortunate, since my case was a right of way situation and it seemed obvious, at least to me. Backing out collisions are tough to pin down, if you want to pursue it I hope you got the details of your witness. |
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| Vive le Quebec |
| glad your situation worked out bad egg. your story is clear proof that insurance companies are legalized scams...fucking cocksuckers. |
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| dtjohnst |
quote:
Originally posted by Vive le Quebec
glad your situation worked out bad egg. your story is clear proof that insurance companies are legalized scams...fucking cocksuckers.
I've had 0 problems with my insurance. Mind you, it was public insurance back in Manitoba. Public is so much better than private. Cheaper, faster, less hassle, and more fair. |
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| Mobius |
| Most definately go to someone at the top with your insurance company. Wawanesa is a flying clusterfuck. No one there knows what they are doing. It took me two months just to remove my RX7 from my policy, and to add a VW Jetta. First they said they could, then they said they couldn't. Each time I called they had no idea what the other person had told me, or why they would tell me that. And finally they cancelled my policy because I wouldn't get an inspection done on my RX7 (which was engineless and I wanted it removed). So I refiled because I was in a hurry, and finally I got insurance. Then another month later I find out it was a bluff. They didn't really cancel my previous insurance, and so I was paying them twice, because I now had two policies. Retards. Next year I'm switching companies for sure. |
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| stuka126 |
Well it's funny how every person who has read that I am with Wawanesa has had some negative comment....Thank god our policy is up in a few weeks.
They knocked my bf's rating down 2 points even though this current dillema hasn't even been resolved...how can they just adjust him to whatever they see fit without the incident resolved?
SIGH....I had the same problem with my car being stolen Mobius...they didn't take it off the policy for like a month, and then they put me on as occasional driver on my bf's Acura, which is standard and I can't even drive it. (which I told them). When he bought that Acura last year it took them 5 months to even send us the policy info, we had a faxed expired pink card. And they say they keep adjusting our rates due to who knows what so every month since I bought the Civic in June our insurance has been different amounts and coming out at different times. Fucked hey?
Crazy company wawanesa is....how long till so many people are pissed off that they have no customers left? |
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| TrevorK |
quote:
Originally posted by stuka126
Well it's funny how every person who has read that I am with Wawanesa has had some negative comment....Thank god our policy is up in a few weeks.
My brother had his SUV written off (After driving into the huge lakes underneath the overpass during the heavy rainfalls) by Wawanesa and had absolutely no problems.
In fact, he got more than he paid for it.
quote:
Crazy company wawanesa is....how long till so many people are pissed off that they have no customers left?
Ask yourself - you've stayed with them this long after all your problems in the past (Before this). |
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| stuka126 |
I got more than I paid for my 1st car when it got stolen, but my problem is with their customer service and with their communication, they are very disorganized and slow.
Not to mention that they don't seem to have files easily accessible because they never seem to be up to date on what's going on. |
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| chavez |
| if your backing up in a parking lot the other driver is 100% at fault. |
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| dtjohnst |
quote:
Originally posted by chavez
if your backing up in a parking lot the other driver is 100% at fault.
Errr....on what planet? What if they stop to let you backup, and you inattentively back into them? Like I said, there are no sweeping generalizations in parking lots, everything is case by case. In fact, most accidents work that way. Although I would say the rule of thumb in parking lots is the person backing up is at fault....not the opposite like you propose. |
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| stuka126 |
Well no new news...
Still awaiting them to return our phone call in regards to speaking with our adjustor's supervisor. We are going to tell them that we have a lawyer that is willing to represent us and that we want the witnesses contacted and a thorough review of the case, and that we do NOT want the claim paid out to the other lady until this is completely investigated.
So far they haven't called us back....but hopefully the supervisor will call us soon..
I'll let u know what happens. |
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| Vive le Quebec |
quote:
Originally posted by stuka126
Well no new news...
Still awaiting them to return our phone call in regards to speaking with our adjustor's supervisor. We are going to tell them that we have a lawyer that is willing to represent us and that we want the witnesses contacted and a thorough review of the case, and that we do NOT want the claim paid out to the other lady until this is completely investigated.
So far they haven't called us back....but hopefully the supervisor will call us soon..
I'll let u know what happens.
Please do, and also tell your insurance company, that at least 200 people have heard your story and will NEVER EVER even consider them for insurance. |
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| dtjohnst |
quote:
Originally posted by stuka126
Well no new news...
Still awaiting them to return our phone call in regards to speaking with our adjustor's supervisor. We are going to tell them that we have a lawyer that is willing to represent us and that we want the witnesses contacted and a thorough review of the case, and that we do NOT want the claim paid out to the other lady until this is completely investigated.
So far they haven't called us back....but hopefully the supervisor will call us soon..
I'll let u know what happens.
Should it ever come to it (in case you don't have a lawyer yet and you're bluffing)....try the Law Society of Alberta for a free referal to 3 lawyers who'll offer a free consultation. 1-800-661-1095, they'll ask you for what area of law you need help with (just describe the problem, they can sort it out) and they'll give you 3 phone numbers. Hopefully you won't need it, but if you do, it'll at least give you an idea where to go and what kind of fees you're looking at. |
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| stuka126 |
| Thanks I will definetly keep that in mind, we don't actually have a lawyer yet we were just hoping that would get the ball moving, so to speak.:fingersx: |
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| Bad Egg |
You won't bluff an insurance company, they are used to people complaining. In my case they waited until the last minute to respond to my small claims case with a blanket countersuit, then just before the court date they actually investigated and found out they were going to lose.
You will need to serve papers to get any kind of reaction. |
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| dtjohnst |
quote:
Originally posted by Bad Egg
You won't bluff an insurance company, they are used to people complaining. In my case they waited until the last minute to respond to my small claims case with a blanket countersuit, then just before the court date they actually investigated and found out they were going to lose.
You will need to serve papers to get any kind of reaction.
What was their countersuit? |
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| Vive le Quebec |
quote:
Originally posted by dtjohnst
What was their countersuit?
too smart to let the big boys win. |
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| Bad Egg |
It was a pretty much blanket countersuit. They accused me of every possible driving violation in the book, some of which couldn't possibly have been part of such an accident.
In my best estimation, it was just a standard response they made to fulfill the obligations of the suit I filed. They have to respond with something by a certain date, so they countersue on every ground they can think of so they don't miss anything. They can drop any or all of the items at any time, and they did eventually. It was obvious that they didn't even look at the particulars of the accident, so that led me to condlude they were just doing the automatic response. |
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